In Ashes Down Under ?

[honkytonk]

Forget who is over there now etc, if it was possible, who would people be picking for the next test (like I said, in a dream scenario)....

[bwildered]

Forget who is over there now etc, if it was possible, who would people be picking for the next test (like I said, in a dream scenario)....

 The labelled cannot bat, bowl and field squad of 1986.

[SirChef26]

I don't think he's good enough, but I'd play Lawrence at the MCG anyway. He's done well at the ground previously and certainly wouldn't let Nathan Lyon make a fool out of him like he did to Ollie Pope. They'll go for boring Bairstow though if Pope does get dropped.

Saqib should be playing and so should Parkinson. Woakes shouldn't even be in Australia, to be honest I'd put him out to pasture like Moeen. He's 33 in March and offers us nothing apart from in England on our green seamers. The future bowling unit of England in the years to come should be some combination of Archer (fat chance), Robinson, Saqib, Wood, S. Curran, Parkinson. I think Garton's a talent as well.

[dazedpenguin]

I'd add Brydon Carse to that list of bowlers.

The ECB have issued a statement to say Archer has had another operation on his elbow and won't be back until the summer. You'd have to worry that he'll just concentrate on white ball cricket from now on. Olly Stone might go the same way.

Saqib is still in Oz playing in the Big Bash, so at least he's playing some cricket. I don't know why they sent Parkinson home, the choice is now between Leach and Bess, both of whom won't be at their most confident after the way they've been treated in the last year. Also a fan of Garton, although he's just coming back from injury too. A quick left armer who can bat a bit- if he lives up to his talent and stays fit all may not be lost.

[honkytonk]

Agree with Alex ad DazedPenguin

[Oldhasbeen]

Re the bowling, I'm largely in agreement with Alex & DP, but I'm more optimistic about Archer, although we will need to manage his workload a lot more carefully.

Other old farts may remember when England moved on from Hoggy and Harmy 15 years ago, giving Jimmy the new ball on the first test in NZ after England were  slaughtered in Aus - IMHO we're at a similar watershed now.

In home Tests next year Anderson, Broad & Woakes may well take more wickets than guys like Carse, Garton and Saqib Mahmood - or Little Chef -  but if we stick with the same lot, the only way is down.

[nat]

Re the bowling, I'm largely in agreement with Alex & DP, but I'm more optimistic about Archer, although we will need to manage his workload a lot more carefully.

Other old farts may remember when England moved on from Hoggy and Harmy 15 years ago, giving Jimmy the new ball on the first test in NZ after England were  slaughtered in Aus - IMHO we're at a similar watershed now.

In home Tests next year Anderson, Broad & Woakes may well take more wickets than guys like Carse, Garton and Saqib Mahmood - or Little Chef -  but if we stick with the same lot, the only way is down.

Look Carse, Garton and Mahmood are pie chuckers. Little Chef is a craftsman as is Robinson (albeit  undisciplined), Bailey, Sanderson, Overton, Anderson (still)....plus spinners like Rashid, Bess (work in progress), Parkinson

Craftsmen are always more successful than pie chuckers. Just take a look at the stats.

[LeedsExile]

Root blaming the bowlers seems ridiculous. Has he not noticed the batsmen are useless? Now Silverwood says "he is still the man for the job". It would be refreshing if he told the truth i.e I am out of my depth and the system has produced this dross.

[bwildered]

Root's captaincy has come under fire in the Ashes , with his decision to bat first at the Gabba, team selection and bowling plans all coming in for criticism.
 Notably, ex-Australia captain Ricky Ponting laid into Root after he admitted England "didn't bowl the right lengths" in the second Test in Adelaide.
"I nearly fell off my seat when I heard that," Ponting said. "Whose job is it then to make them change? Why are you captain then?
"If you can't influence your bowlers on what length to bowl, what are you doing on the field?"

Fair point Ricky.
 Problem also is that some seniors think they are quicker than they are and also know better.

[Oldhasbeen]

"Look Carse, Garton and Mahmood are pie chuckers" . Thanks for that deep insight Nat. Must take really deep cricket knowledge to write this sort of stuff.

Here's a thought experiment for you:

The England management take your advice and, alongside Robinson & Stokes, select Tom Bailey and Ben Sanderson as the seam attack for the next Test. What do you think the reaction in the Australian dressing room would be? Clue: it won't include the word "fear".

Happy Xmas!

[bobw]

I see in todays Telegraph that Anderson thinks the coaching team should be telling the bowlers to change length when they go ing for lunch.

i would have though that a bowler of his experience should know when to change length during a spell. I know I do as a village bowler. if I am being hit I need to change length , line or both. I do this during a spell if not an over. Why can't Englands bowlers?

[LeedsExile]

So 4 changes on the Titanic. If Bairstow plays he should keep but Buttler is undroppable it seems. Looks like the end for Burns which is a bit hard as he at least hangs around sometimes. Hameed better score runs soon. Woakes had to go as he never takes many wickets overseas and poor old Leach is chucked into the firing line again. The batting looks weaker to me which is concerning.

[nat]

So 4 changes on the Titanic. If Bairstow plays he should keep but Buttler is undroppable it seems. Looks like the end for Burns which is a bit hard as he at least hangs around sometimes. Hameed better score runs soon. Woakes had to go as he never takes many wickets overseas and poor old Leach is chucked into the firing line again. The batting looks weaker to me which is concerning.

Can only see another heavy defeat. Worst Ashes team ever?

[Andy]

I see in todays Telegraph that Anderson thinks the coaching team should be telling the bowlers to change length when they go ing for lunch.

i would have though that a bowler of his experience should know when to change length during a spell. I know I do as a village bowler. if I am being hit I need to change length , line or both. I do this during a spell if not an over. Why can't Englands bowlers?

It’s the blame game already. I’ve just notched up my half century and fancy things couldn’t get much if I bought meself a ticket to Australia.

[bwildered]

The, “We could have tour, “ continues to be the nightmare predicted, starting with the toss then …..ditto
Cannot see Root continuing after the series,  problem now is next man to the plate Stokes, sadly now bats like he is trying to replicate Headingly every time.