In Ashes Down Under ?

[nat]

Yep it is no accident that the best players tend to come from private schools where there are better facilities, more opportunity to play/practice and greater priority given to cricket compared to football.

[afinetickletoleg]

My thoughts are that we do need a higher level of competition but that the county structure should remain as is.

My solution to this would be to add a red ball competition made up of 4/5 regions with each region pulling from a selection of counties.  Games would then be played on the test match grounds over 5 days under full test match conditions.  In effect these would be trials for the England team but by giving it official status it may well draw in some sponsorship for the ECB.  These would be scheduled as much as possible to play in the middle of summer and contracted players to play if fit and not playing in a test match.

This would then enable the Championship to continue as normal, perhaps with the opportunity to reduce games to 3 days as some would like.  The better 2 XI players would then be given the opportunity to step up and play a higher lever level of red ball cricket in a competition that people care about.  The places opened up in 2 XI cricket could then be used to trial the better club players.

It is similar to a red ball equivalent to the Hundred but without the franchises and with a point of providing a pathway to the national team.

The good thing that came out of the Hundred last season was the absence of a lot of the usual overseas mercenaries provided the opportunity for younger, previously unknown, players to make a name for themselves.  Some did and will get a contract again this year.

[nat]

My thoughts are that we do need a higher level of competition but that the county structure should remain as is.

My solution to this would be to add a red ball competition made up of 4/5 regions with each region pulling from a selection of counties.  Games would then be played on the test match grounds over 5 days under full test match conditions.  In effect these would be trials for the England team but by giving it official status it may well draw in some sponsorship for the ECB.  These would be scheduled as much as possible to play in the middle of summer and contracted players to play if fit and not playing in a test match.

This would then enable the Championship to continue as normal, perhaps with the opportunity to reduce games to 3 days as some would like.  The better 2 XI players would then be given the opportunity to step up and play a higher lever level of red ball cricket in a competition that people care about.  The places opened up in 2 XI cricket could then be used to trial the better club players.

It is similar to a red ball equivalent to the Hundred but without the franchises and with a point of providing a pathway to the national team.

The good thing that came out of the Hundred last season was the absence of a lot of the usual overseas mercenaries provided the opportunity for younger, previously unknown, players to make a name for themselves.  Some did and will get a contract again this year.

No, no, no.

[Andy]

My thoughts are that we do need a higher level of competition but that the county structure should remain as is.

My solution to this would be to add a red ball competition made up of 4/5 regions with each region pulling from a selection of counties.  Games would then be played on the test match grounds over 5 days under full test match conditions.  In effect these would be trials for the England team but by giving it official status it may well draw in some sponsorship for the ECB.  These would be scheduled as much as possible to play in the middle of summer and contracted players to play if fit and not playing in a test match.

This would then enable the Championship to continue as normal, perhaps with the opportunity to reduce games to 3 days as some would like.  The better 2 XI players would then be given the opportunity to step up and play a higher lever level of red ball cricket in a competition that people care about.  The places opened up in 2 XI cricket could then be used to trial the better club players.

It is similar to a red ball equivalent to the Hundred but without the franchises and with a point of providing a pathway to the national team.

The good thing that came out of the Hundred last season was the absence of a lot of the usual overseas mercenaries provided the opportunity for younger, previously unknown, players to make a name for themselves.  Some did and will get a contract again this year.

Essentially Agnews plan, but with regions instead of franchises. Might as well go with 10 franchises than to devalue the county system further.

[Andy]

Will the squad be arrested for breaking lockdowns? Could the authorities throw in a charge of crimes against the sanity of all England supporters?

[kingstonj1]

As much as I hate the idea of reducing the status of counties it doesn’t provide the foundation for future test players in its present form, even if more matches are played throughout the season in my view. There is no comparison between our mostly small county set ups & the state teams in Australia. I do think we have to raise the standard in the county game & if that means having a higher level competition so be it.

In Australia, it is not the State system that works better than our county system, but the fact that cricket is played by a higher proportion of the population from the lowest levels of club cricket upwards. It has been the much more flexible grade cricket system that allows someone with talent to progress upwards faster in order to stretch themselves.

.

This is a good post.

Its all well and good saying we should mirror the shield but its comparing apples and oranges.

The population of Australia is 25million, England and Wales 60 odd million and growing.

6 state sides works for a small population base whereas we can support more teams. The caveat is that nowadays far less proportion of the UK population in cricket whereas i suspect most proportion in Australia still do. Despite this the base should still support more than 6 teams.

State teams get no support. Counties do. The majority of Australians live in the big cities/towns. Our population is far more spread out.

Division 1 was considered the highest standard of domestic cricket by Aussie overseas player in the 2000's.

The issue is not the number of counties, not with a 2 division structure, the best play the best, so there no need to change the number of teams so long as 2 divisions is maintained. The issues are the sidelining of the 4 day game for the limited overs one. Simple as that. play 4 day cricket on decent pitches in the actual summer and scores will go up, batsmen will bat longer, bowlers will have to find out ways to get them out rather than dobbing it around and relying on the pitch a la Stevens (and our seamers to an extent). Play with the kookaburra ball if needs be and give more batting points to encourage long innings.

It also boils down to the point of county cricket, to serve the England team or in its own right. given the skewed finances, nowadays it is to support the England team as without it counties would not be solvent.

Its also cyclical and a big noise over something that will always occur. They lose here we lose there. English conditions are alien to most others so our cricketers will be different. In the past they played as o/s in the Currie Cup which gave them experience of Australia like conditions, but still we didnt win much.

This is a huge hysteria over something that was of our own making and covid. No warm ups, lack of preparation, what did anyone expect? To jump from all that to say the whole county structure needs changing is nonsense, but in todays age where blame is always due and things have to e seen to be done to improve it instantly any failing/perceived injustice warrants a massive overreaction. Silly but i blame social media...the ills of most things can be laid at its door in all aspects of society.

TLDR, this is a fuss over nothing and just an excuse for those who want to destroy the 18 county structure.

[smandlej]

Steve made the point that there are 18 counties and 36 opening batsmen and those who went to Australia were the ones they chose and, presumably, the ones they thought were the best.  If they reduce it to 8 or 10 counties, there would only be 16-20 opening batsmen, so even less choice for openers and all other positions in the team.

We don't like the present system whereby the big counties poach good players from the smaller counties, but it sort of works: the big counties then have to release decent players who can't get a game and who then find new homes at the smaller counties, so it's swings and roundabouts.  If you cut down the number of counties, some of these good players may never see the light of day.

Lynda and Steve

[LeedsExile]

I wish there was a means of "liking" a post on this board. The last two are both excellent and reasonable.

[essexfan548]

I live in Buckinghamshire and we still have Grammars so there is school cricket.

However the village clubs are closing through lack of volunteers/players. When we moved here the village had two teams - none now. The larger village which ran age group teams from 7 [with waiting lists] is gone as well as several others locally.

[kingstonj1]

I should also have said about Grade cricket. We do not have any equivalent here. The better Grade teams would give the weaker counties a very good game if not better them. Likewise the attitude is different...i belive its still the case that test players, there still turn out for their grade sides when they can. Can you imagine that happening in England, for SNEL or EAPL teams? This isn't a problem in itself as county cricket by having 18 teams, fills that gap to an extent, with the weaker clubs being the opportunity for discarded players (as poster mentions above) or those who mature later, to come again and get that chance. So to get rid of 6 or so counties completely removes that stepping post, so reducing counties will, imo, have an adverse effect on the talent pool. Some don't like it, but 2 divisions, with the better players moving to the division 1 counties, as we tend to see happen naturally nowadays (before covid) has the same effect as reducing teams with the intent of best vs best, (and a massive reason the conference system used last year was a silly idea) so to make it happen artificially is not needed and pointless, not even touching on the impact on the county fan of such a step and the creation of artificial non partisan franchises that no one cares about and riding roughshod over tradition.

I thinks there's a saying about players being 6 hundreds away from the test team in Australia. Score 3 for your grade team you make State. Score 3 in State you get in the test team.

[bobw]

I agree with most of the above comments apart from one aspect. We do not have 18 counties. We have 18 counties and the England squad.

[smandlej]

I agree with most of the above comments apart from one aspect. We do not have 18 counties. We have 18 counties and the England squad.

Not a problem, if someone sees sense and decides that England players should be back playing for their counties at every available opportunity.

Lynda

[Crisp]

I agree with most of the above comments apart from one aspect. We do not have 18 counties. We have 18 counties and the England squad.

Not a problem, if someone sees sense and decides that England players should be back playing for their counties at every available opportunity.

Its one thing telling them to play for there Counties, but as a player you must want to play for your county, Chef was the best because even as England captain he wanted to play for us.

But 75% of the others have the Buttler/Pietersen attitude.

Rather than play as they did 20 years ago, they choose to rest and recuperate, joke!!!

[Bath Hammer]

My thoughts are that we do need a higher level of competition but that the county structure should remain as is.

My solution to this would be to add a red ball competition made up of 4/5 regions with each region pulling from a selection of counties.  Games would then be played on the test match grounds over 5 days under full test match conditions.  In effect these would be trials for the England team but by giving it official status it may well draw in some sponsorship for the ECB.  These would be scheduled as much as possible to play in the middle of summer and contracted players to play if fit and not playing in a test match.

This would then enable the Championship to continue as normal, perhaps with the opportunity to reduce games to 3 days as some would like.  The better 2 XI players would then be given the opportunity to step up and play a higher lever level of red ball cricket in a competition that people care about.  The places opened up in 2 XI cricket could then be used to trial the better club players.

It is similar to a red ball equivalent to the Hundred but without the franchises and with a point of providing a pathway to the national team.

The good thing that came out of the Hundred last season was the absence of a lot of the usual overseas mercenaries provided the opportunity for younger, previously unknown, players to make a name for themselves.  Some did and will get a contract again this year.

This was what Agnew was advocating & I agree.

[afinetickletoleg]

My thoughts are that we do need a higher level of competition but that the county structure should remain as is.

My solution to this would be to add a red ball competition made up of 4/5 regions with each region pulling from a selection of counties.  Games would then be played on the test match grounds over 5 days under full test match conditions.  In effect these would be trials for the England team but by giving it official status it may well draw in some sponsorship for the ECB.  These would be scheduled as much as possible to play in the middle of summer and contracted players to play if fit and not playing in a test match.

This would then enable the Championship to continue as normal, perhaps with the opportunity to reduce games to 3 days as some would like.  The better 2 XI players would then be given the opportunity to step up and play a higher lever level of red ball cricket in a competition that people care about.  The places opened up in 2 XI cricket could then be used to trial the better club players.

It is similar to a red ball equivalent to the Hundred but without the franchises and with a point of providing a pathway to the national team.

The good thing that came out of the Hundred last season was the absence of a lot of the usual overseas mercenaries provided the opportunity for younger, previously unknown, players to make a name for themselves.  Some did and will get a contract again this year.

This was what Agnew was advocating & I agree.

Well Agnew was advocating 10 franchises rather than 4/5 regions but I’m glad that someone agrees 😄