Author Topic: 2021 Team  (Read 17314 times)

Offline afinetickletoleg

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #105 on: June 16, 2021, 04:25:25 PM »
It was established that the Olympic stadium is unsuitable for Cricket unless major changes are made.


It’s unsuitable for football as well but it hasn’t stopped West Ham.

Offline SirChef26

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #106 on: June 16, 2021, 08:39:11 PM »
Well, if the Glamorgan "effort" was "embarrassingly rubbish" then I don't even know where to begin to describe THAT tonight!

The best way I can think to describe it is to think back 20 years to the Nat West trophy first round when a minor counties side would play a first class county and remember the gulf in class between the two sides!

I think we all knew that we would be poor in this T20 competition, but I don't think many thought we would be so utterly and completely atrocious, arguably the worst T20 side ever that Essex have had.
No arguably about it, we absolutely are, not to mention the worst side of all 18 counties. Paul Walter, who would struggle to get into any other team in the country is batting at four, whilst our overseas bats at 6. Tom Westley, arguably the least aggressive player in the team opens the batting. You wouldn't find a club cricketer scared of bowling at Westley in the powerplay. Harmer bats at 7, when you could argue that he shouldn't even be batting at 8. He also takes up a valuable overseas spot, but we're stuck as he's so important to us in red ball that we can't afford to piss him off and risk him going elsewhere. Lawrence isn't going to magically repair anything (I assume he's taken a week off having had pretty much no time off since Christmas)

Worst thing is, I don't see anything from the young kids that suggests they'll become gun limited overs players in the future. Plom may have a little something about him, but only a little something.

Whoever is making the decisions clearly has absolutely no idea on how to set up a T20 side in the modern era. It's certainly no coincidence that none of the players (or coaches for that matter) have been picked recruited by a hundred franchise. At this point, I think we need to consider a specialist T20 coach.

A word on Sussex though, I'm very impressed by them at the moment. A thriving academy producing plenty of top young cricketers far superior to our current crop of kids. Also cracking on with their ground development while we boast about a new gate! Right now, they are doing everything that we should be doing!

Offline nat

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #107 on: June 16, 2021, 08:56:14 PM »
Yep Alex spot on.

Offline JasonP

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #108 on: June 16, 2021, 09:07:10 PM »
Well, if the Glamorgan "effort" was "embarrassingly rubbish" then I don't even know where to begin to describe THAT tonight!

The best way I can think to describe it is to think back 20 years to the Nat West trophy first round when a minor counties side would play a first class county and remember the gulf in class between the two sides!

I think we all knew that we would be poor in this T20 competition, but I don't think many thought we would be so utterly and completely atrocious, arguably the worst T20 side ever that Essex have had.
No arguably about it, we absolutely are, not to mention the worst side of all 18 counties. Paul Walter, who would struggle to get into any other team in the country is batting at four, whilst our overseas bats at 6. Tom Westley, arguably the least aggressive player in the team opens the batting. You wouldn't find a club cricketer scared of bowling at Westley in the powerplay. Harmer bats at 7, when you could argue that he shouldn't even be batting at 8. He also takes up a valuable overseas spot, but we're stuck as he's so important to us in red ball that we can't afford to piss him off and risk him going elsewhere. Lawrence isn't going to magically repair anything (I assume he's taken a week off having had pretty much no time off since Christmas)

Worst thing is, I don't see anything from the young kids that suggests they'll become gun limited overs players in the future. Plom may have a little something about him, but only a little something.

Whoever is making the decisions clearly has absolutely no idea on how to set up a T20 side in the modern era. It's certainly no coincidence that none of the players (or coaches for that matter) have been picked recruited by a hundred franchise. At this point, I think we need to consider a specialist T20 coach.

A word on Sussex though, I'm very impressed by them at the moment. A thriving academy producing plenty of top young cricketers far superior to our current crop of kids. Also cracking on with their ground development while we boast about a new gate! Right now, they are doing everything that we should be doing!

Sussex are a club that have openly admitted that they are putting pretty much all their eggs in the T20 basket as it’s where the revenue comes from.  They have a number of players like Bopara, Mills, Wright  and Rashid Khan who are T20 only and won’t come cheap.  They have barely won a match in 4 day cricket over the last 2 or 3 years.  If we were doing this people on here would not be happy!

Offline ytsejam1

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #109 on: June 16, 2021, 10:22:20 PM »
Well, if the Glamorgan "effort" was "embarrassingly rubbish" then I don't even know where to begin to describe THAT tonight!

The best way I can think to describe it is to think back 20 years to the Nat West trophy first round when a minor counties side would play a first class county and remember the gulf in class between the two sides!

I think we all knew that we would be poor in this T20 competition, but I don't think many thought we would be so utterly and completely atrocious, arguably the worst T20 side ever that Essex have had.
No arguably about it, we absolutely are, not to mention the worst side of all 18 counties. Paul Walter, who would struggle to get into any other team in the country is batting at four, whilst our overseas bats at 6. Tom Westley, arguably the least aggressive player in the team opens the batting. You wouldn't find a club cricketer scared of bowling at Westley in the powerplay. Harmer bats at 7, when you could argue that he shouldn't even be batting at 8. He also takes up a valuable overseas spot, but we're stuck as he's so important to us in red ball that we can't afford to piss him off and risk him going elsewhere. Lawrence isn't going to magically repair anything (I assume he's taken a week off having had pretty much no time off since Christmas)

Worst thing is, I don't see anything from the young kids that suggests they'll become gun limited overs players in the future. Plom may have a little something about him, but only a little something.

Whoever is making the decisions clearly has absolutely no idea on how to set up a T20 side in the modern era. It's certainly no coincidence that none of the players (or coaches for that matter) have been picked recruited by a hundred franchise. At this point, I think we need to consider a specialist T20 coach.

A word on Sussex though, I'm very impressed by them at the moment. A thriving academy producing plenty of top young cricketers far superior to our current crop of kids. Also cracking on with their ground development while we boast about a new gate! Right now, they are doing everything that we should be doing!

Sussex are a club that have openly admitted that they are putting pretty much all their eggs in the T20 basket as it’s where the revenue comes from.  They have a number of players like Bopara, Mills, Wright  and Rashid Khan who are T20 only and won’t come cheap.  They have barely won a match in 4 day cricket over the last 2 or 3 years. If we were doing this people on here would not be happy!
[/b]

That’s a good point to be fair. Although like you say Sussex DO admit what they are doing, whereas Essex are still pretending that they are very competitive in the T20 stuff and try to make us believe that they are taking it seriously and have high hopes!!!

Offline Perov

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #110 on: June 17, 2021, 07:38:55 AM »
Alex, this would be the Sussex set up producing top young kids ( superior to Essex), that just recently got hammered by our second eleven for 477 - 6,  bowled out for 191, and  struggled to 146-3, only to be saved by an early finish due to weather?

I agree that they are better set up for T20, but our kids are as good in longer cricket.
Nijjar is a better T20 bowler than Harmer,  Pepper is making progress, Buttleman, although young, will become a good player, and Allison should not be underestimated.




Offline Slogger

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #111 on: June 17, 2021, 09:27:23 AM »
I worked with a Sussex member who told me their ground improvements were partly funded by a substantial legacy. As an aside, he was most surprised when I told him Essex members have to buy tickets for T20 matches.

Offline bwildered

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #112 on: June 17, 2021, 09:35:58 AM »
Well, if the Glamorgan "effort" was "embarrassingly rubbish" then I don't even know where to begin to describe THAT tonight!

The best way I can think to describe it is to think back 20 years to the Nat West trophy first round when a minor counties side would play a first class county and remember the gulf in class between the two sides!

I think we all knew that we would be poor in this T20 competition, but I don't think many thought we would be so utterly and completely atrocious, arguably the worst T20 side ever that Essex have had.
No arguably about it, we absolutely are, not to mention the worst side of all 18 counties. Paul Walter, who would struggle to get into any other team in the country is batting at four, whilst our overseas bats at 6. Tom Westley, arguably the least aggressive player in the team opens the batting. You wouldn't find a club cricketer scared of bowling at Westley in the powerplay. Harmer bats at 7, when you could argue that he shouldn't even be batting at 8. He also takes up a valuable overseas spot, but we're stuck as he's so important to us in red ball that we can't afford to piss him off and risk him going elsewhere. Lawrence isn't going to magically repair anything (I assume he's taken a week off having had pretty much no time off since Christmas)

Worst thing is, I don't see anything from the young kids that suggests they'll become gun limited overs players in the future. Plom may have a little something about him, but only a little something.

Whoever is making the decisions clearly has absolutely no idea on how to set up a T20 side in the modern era. It's certainly no coincidence that none of the players (or coaches for that matter) have been picked recruited by a hundred franchise. At this point, I think we need to consider a specialist T20 coach.

A word on Sussex though, I'm very impressed by them at the moment. A thriving academy producing plenty of top young cricketers far superior to our current crop of kids. Also cracking on with their ground development while we boast about a new gate! Right now, they are doing everything that we should be doing!

Sussex are a club that have openly admitted that they are putting pretty much all their eggs in the T20 basket as it’s where the revenue comes from.  They have a number of players like Bopara, Mills, Wright  and Rashid Khan who are T20 only and won’t come cheap.  They have barely won a match in 4 day cricket over the last 2 or 3 years.  If we were doing this people on here would not be happy!

JP - what ever the club do ,some people are unhappy!  Got to stage have a pop at winning red ball games !!
« Last Edit: June 17, 2021, 09:55:39 AM by bwildered »

Offline LeedsExile

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #113 on: June 17, 2021, 09:44:37 AM »
I do not think Sussex should be suggested as something to emulate. They have dispensed with all their experienced red ball players so are abject in that format. They may or may not do ok at 20/20 but that is largely a lottery. Their Chief Executive is Rob Andrew who hardly endeared himself to followers of Rugby Union during his time at Twickenham. Most of the ground improvements at Hove were due to the substantial Spen Camara legacy but that money has now been spent I understand.

Offline Mog

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #114 on: June 17, 2021, 10:02:27 AM »
Well, if the Glamorgan "effort" was "embarrassingly rubbish" then I don't even know where to begin to describe THAT tonight!

The best way I can think to describe it is to think back 20 years to the Nat West trophy first round when a minor counties side would play a first class county and remember the gulf in class between the two sides!

I think we all knew that we would be poor in this T20 competition, but I don't think many thought we would be so utterly and completely atrocious, arguably the worst T20 side ever that Essex have had.
No arguably about it, we absolutely are, not to mention the worst side of all 18 counties. Paul Walter, who would struggle to get into any other team in the country is batting at four, whilst our overseas bats at 6. Tom Westley, arguably the least aggressive player in the team opens the batting. You wouldn't find a club cricketer scared of bowling at Westley in the powerplay. Harmer bats at 7, when you could argue that he shouldn't even be batting at 8. He also takes up a valuable overseas spot, but we're stuck as he's so important to us in red ball that we can't afford to piss him off and risk him going elsewhere. Lawrence isn't going to magically repair anything (I assume he's taken a week off having had pretty much no time off since Christmas)

Worst thing is, I don't see anything from the young kids that suggests they'll become gun limited overs players in the future. Plom may have a little something about him, but only a little something.

Whoever is making the decisions clearly has absolutely no idea on how to set up a T20 side in the modern era. It's certainly no coincidence that none of the players (or coaches for that matter) have been picked recruited by a hundred franchise. At this point, I think we need to consider a specialist T20 coach.

A word on Sussex though, I'm very impressed by them at the moment. A thriving academy producing plenty of top young cricketers far superior to our current crop of kids. Also cracking on with their ground development while we boast about a new gate! Right now, they are doing everything that we should be doing!


Your post evokes more similarities with how Essex have gone about several aspects of T20, going back a long way, Alex. In particular, how they have never really learnt lessons and yet continue to ignore all advice and just do what they've always done, a continuum.
When the competition began and for several seasons hence, the Club had no clue how to approach the competition and as a consequence were regularly embarrassed by teams who had a coherent plan and approach.
The timidity and inability to upset *star* players, can be traced back to the start of the competition with deification of the likes of Irani, Grayson, Gough et al., and more recently with the likes of Oais Shah. Remember Grayson, when coach, telling us how he would have to make tough decisions on team selections, which was always code for; 'I'll drop young so and so, (who had just happened to make a big impact) to make room for my half-fit, and quarter engaged mate'.

I have a strong inclination that Essex's approach to T20 this season, as much reflects that such small numbers are permitted to attend matches. So as the Club cannot make their usual profit level from the competition, they have consequently downgraded it in importance and priority. As noted above, the strategic approach remains very much unchanged!
« Last Edit: June 17, 2021, 10:04:27 AM by Mog »

Offline essexfan548

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #115 on: June 17, 2021, 11:02:53 AM »
I do not think Sussex should be suggested as something to emulate. They have dispensed with all their experienced red ball players so are abject in that format. They may or may not do ok at 20/20 but that is largely a lottery. Their Chief Executive is Rob Andrew who hardly endeared himself to followers of Rugby Union during his time at Twickenham. Most of the ground improvements at Hove were due to the substantial Spen Camara legacy but that money has now been spent I understand.

I agree - I lived in Hastings for 18 years and still have local connections. They are not a well-regarded club by cricket supporters. Whatever they do to Hove doesn't make it 'attractive' ...

Offline SirChef26

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #116 on: June 17, 2021, 11:07:52 AM »
Lots of people using the excuse that Sussex struggle in red ball cricket as an reason that we are doing better than them. Sussex are giving matchtime to all their young kids in the County Championship knowing that the way forward is to blood them early on. They had a 16-year-old lad playing in their last first class game who scored a half century. They are in the midst of a long term plan regarding their academy talent which will bear fruit in the coming years. Mark my words, fast forward a few years and they will be in a far better place than us from a red ball perspective.

Alex, this would be the Sussex set up producing top young kids ( superior to Essex), that just recently got hammered by our second eleven for 477 - 6,  bowled out for 191, and  struggled to 146-3, only to be saved by an early finish due to weather?

I agree that they are better set up for T20, but our kids are as good in longer cricket.
Nijjar is a better T20 bowler than Harmer,  Pepper is making progress, Buttleman, although young, will become a good player, and Allison should not be underestimated.




With respect Perov, nobody of importance within the game cares about second eleven cricket. It's a joke, like reserve team football. A quick look at that scorecard on the Essex site suggests that Sussex had a team of GCSE aged kids playing whilst we had 33-year-old Chopra (who will probably not play for us again) and 26-year-old Nijar. Sussex's spinner in the same XI (the same lad who got MOTM on Sky last week) is TEN years younger than Nijar.

Offline JasonP

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #117 on: June 17, 2021, 02:48:16 PM »
If tomorrows forecast is correct, and they haven't been that great this year, then that will be the 4th time in succession that the Essex v Gloucester T20 fixture at Chelmsford will be abandoned without a ball being bowled.  Would be some kind of record, surely.  Pretty bad luck for Gloucester seeing as we've barely won at Chelmsford in T20s over the last 3 years.

Offline Suffolk Richard

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #118 on: June 17, 2021, 07:17:19 PM »
Professional sport is all about winning and not the taking part. Let's hope all our squad take note and show some fight going forward.

Offline honkytonk

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Re: 2021 Team
« Reply #119 on: June 18, 2021, 02:05:16 PM »
Professional sport is all about winning and not the taking part. Let's hope all our squad take note and show some fight going forward.

Not sure it is about the fight, I just think some are not good enough/up to it anymore